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From: "Dr. Jason Gastrich" <news@jcsm.org>
Newsgroups: alt.fan.uncle-davey
References: <vsm893o7att892@corp.supernews.com> <bqf9q2$697$1@nemesis.news.tpi.pl>
Subject: Re: Baptism: Not A Requirement for Salvation
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Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2003 11:52:05 GMT
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Uncle Davey wrote:
> news:vsm893o7att892@corp.supernews.com...
>> This article is not archived in the free.christian newsgroup on
>> Google. Reposted for all to see.
>
> <article snipped>
>
> Baptism, being one of the two sacraments, is an outward sign of an
> inward grace.
>
> Just as the other sacrament, the Lord's Supper, is not a 'means of
> grace' as the Catholics call it, but in fact gives you no benefit,
> (and at least in the apostolic period if not today actually physical
> harm, if you eat and drink unworthily), so also baptism makes not a
> blind bit of difference to a person's salvation.
>
> Even in the Covenant theology applied by Presbyterians and
> Congregationalists who are evangelicals which baptise the children of
> believers, there is no suggestion that a believer's children are more
> likely to get saved if they are baptised than if they are not.
> Baptists on the other hand believe that a person should be converted
> already prior to baptism. Very well then, if they are converted, then
> is the blood of christ already applied to them or not at that time,
> or are they on a kind of provisional licence, before they actually
> get baptised, and if they let too many weeks run by between
> conversion and baptism, they could actually fall away?
>
> There is not any suggestion of that in scripture. The sign of baptism
> is to strengthen the believer and give a blessing. That's one of the
> reasons why I didn't get my kids baptised, although I am a Calvinist.
>
> When we say that baptism is a necessary part of what we need to have
> for salvation, then why not the Lord's supper every week as well? And
> then we fall right into the sacerdotalism that characterises most of
> Anglicanism, Eastern Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism.
>
> At the end of the day baptism is an act which we carry out, and in
> fact a God-centred view of salvation ought to see that salvation is
> what God does, rather than what we strive for. Grace is
> irresistable, redemption perfect. No works from us required in the
> salvation process.
>
> I'm sorry if that's not a webpage, or an essay, or a research paper,
> but I'm a Usenetter; I do Usenet posts.
>
> Uncle Davey
Excellent post, brother.
God bless,
Jason
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